Already in Love!

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PETROLHEAD
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Already in Love!

Post by PETROLHEAD »

Well, i think i drove my new Italian Stallion all of about 5 miles before realising I was in Love with her already!


Thanks to some creative jiggery wheeler dealery, I just managed to pick this up earlier tonight from its former keeper, John (Taffioch)


and so here it is on his drive,
DSC_0003.JPG



and 40 miles later on mine!
DSC_0004.JPG


Ive always liked the slight peculiarity of the 164, but they have till now evaded my purchase radar, but this 3.0 QV proved far too good to let slip by.

John is an absolute star it has to be said, and has cared for the car, as he does all his vehicles, like his left nut depended on it, and it really shone through within moments of driving the beastie home.


I'm going to thoroughly enjoy every mile of this for as long as possible, thats for certain, and with a few personal touches planned already, i hope to make it the best 164 QV out there, which shoudn't be too hard!



and finally, it looks like i'll get to a few meets and events actually in an Alfa this year, instead of a vauxhall van and a camera phone full of ideas! ha ha! :lol:


Thanks again John, and partner in crime, Kev, for your middle man involvement too

you've both made me a happy man! :D
SHREW

I AM the Law!


Alfasud 1.7-16v, Charade Turbo SR, & The Dirty Diesels - GT Cloverleaf, 159 Ti Sportwagon, Saab 9-3 Sportwagon

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KevJTD
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by KevJTD »

glad you like it mate, knew you would though, the V6 is a peach isn't it 8-)
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alfasuddriver
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by alfasuddriver »

I love the 3.0 164, it's the ultimate cruiser!

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Johnboy
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by Johnboy »

Very nice chap! So will this be on the caf stand for are first event ;)
Best colour too 8-)
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by Veesix75 »

Very nice.

Always wanted a 164 and 166 v6.

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PETROLHEAD
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by PETROLHEAD »

Thanks chaps,

yes the V6 24v version of Busso's Beast is indeed peach, making the whole car a bit of a wolf in sheeps clothing,. which is exactly what i wanted.


i'm no stranger to it of course, but the 147 gta is a very very differrent kettle of frogs!


so yes, i'll have a car for meets and stands at last this year, pressure off the sud/33 project a tad though (downside really!)



the surprise is the torque steer from such a large cruiser type car, its quite apparent, not dangerous but intrusive enough to make you think about things, but i love it, it will help keep me from the traffic light grand prix a bit! ha ha!
SHREW

I AM the Law!


Alfasud 1.7-16v, Charade Turbo SR, & The Dirty Diesels - GT Cloverleaf, 159 Ti Sportwagon, Saab 9-3 Sportwagon

gibot123
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by gibot123 »

I spent my early years going through the Sud's and 33's and was so pleased when I found the 164 24v super A grown up sud in my opinion. and with a much better build quality and and engine that more than replaces the fantastic boxer I loved so much.
I know you will enjoy it . The driving position is also the best in any of the Alfa's I have owned and I still after 12 years prefer being behind the wheel of mine more than the 156's and 147 I have owned .
You look to have a really good one there and as mine I think the black actually suits the car better than the Alfa red.
Congrats enjoy.
I wish I had mine up to the standard of yours as the car deserves it but cash wont allow me to get there but shes still a strong runner and will bend over backward to keep mine on the road at least. :D

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PETROLHEAD
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by PETROLHEAD »

Thanks Chaps, all compliments well received! :D

although of course i can't take any credit for it yet, thats would be down to Johns tlc to date.



It is a great drive for sure, always have loved all things Alfa V6 to be fair.

V6 and Boxer, rule the world!


Funny you should mention the driving position though. It is certainly a very very comfortable drive, the seats are fantastic, but i'm going to have to play around with the positions some more yet before i find the perfect ride site!

The seats lovely, steering wheel up the the highest position, but it still cuts off the top of the clocks.

I have had other cars like this, and if ive done what i can then of course i'll live with it happily, but otherwise its poor design, as the needle is almost invisible just where you need to see it, on the boarders of naughtyville and law abiding for motorway speeds!

Anyone else experience this with theirs 164's?


Also, did they ever do an armrest version of the seats, or console?
SHREW

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gibot123
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by gibot123 »

My super has an arm rest thats attached to the seat.

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PETROLHEAD
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by PETROLHEAD »

Thanks Gibot.

i have to say, i kinda miss an armrest, even have one in the van, so it might be nice to get one in the 164 eventually.

is it an add on or integrated Gibbot?
SHREW

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AlfaCorseChris
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by AlfaCorseChris »

Oh nice ! :)

Rodger's QV was recently resprayed as well, in red.

Tell me something... I know its a heavy car and all, but comparing to the 2.5 GTV6, has it got about the same power or a bit less ?

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PETROLHEAD
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by PETROLHEAD »

As far as I know Chris, the 3.0 litres are a full fat 220bhp motor in 24v and this spec.

Certainly goes mate, feels every bit of that I reckon!


I don't know the claimed power for the 2.5 gtv6, but the v6 12v 155 I had was supposed to be just shy of 160 bhp, is that close enough for comparison?
SHREW

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AlfaCorseChris
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by AlfaCorseChris »

Well I was kinda hoping I'd get a comparison to something I drove many times :)

A 3ltr 164 has turned up here for sale, quite cheap as well, and I was tempted
Mind you, I've not seen it yet and got no idea if its the 12 or 24v one

Lightfoot
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by Lightfoot »

Hello Everyone - new member here, recruited (or 'radicalised' perhaps!) by Shrew, after I contacted him via his CarandClassic advert for his 164 24V 'Leaf which is For Sale (No, DON'T Do It -Don't sell!).

Rather than ramble on about my 164 I thought I's 'cut and paste' an article on the subject of the 164 QV which I submitted to Auto-Italia ooh, a couple of years (maybe longer, come to think of it) ago. Let's see if this works:


Alfa Romeo 164 Cloverleaf

"I hereby lay my cards firmly on the table and claim the 164 Cloverleaf to be one of the great Alfa Romeos . This is a classy and elegant-looking car with a magnificent jewel of an engine that delivers stunning performance to a refined and cultured soundtrack, while the deftly-tuned handling builds, with acquaintance, to inspire immense levels of confidence whatever the road conditions. This is truly a machine worth bonding with. The Cloverleaf is also one of the most discreet cars I’ve ever driven. It never attracts unwanted attention and yet it has undeniable street presence. Special it most certainly is and definitely one of my most rewarding automotive purchases.

I do, however, confess to approaching my first example of Alfa Romeo ownership with a certain trepidation, or, lightly to paraphrase, “Ah, Mr. Bond, your reputation precedes you!” Reliability, however, has actually proved to be one of the car’s strong points over my six years’ tenure and, added to the previous owner’s nine, has resulted in a dependable machine that has only ever known a professional working life. Sure, it has needed a fair few parts along the way (new radiator, clutch and a gearbox overhaul at 105,000 miles followed by a massive suspension rebuild at Benalfa Cars at 134,000 miles) but the engine remains healthy and un-opened after having reached the 150,000-mile mark.

Ah, that engine! In 3-litre, 24v, 230 BHP form, it’s deep, sonorous and melodious (rather than orchestral) in sound. Enough has been said about its pedigree but the performance is still a revelation to me. Forget about 0-60 dashes (approx 7 secs), feel the way this car goes from 100-145 MPH. That’s where its true strength lies. It hauls long and hard through the gears and just never seems to run out of breath – ever! I bet the Italian police adored them!

A key point worthy of praise is a chassis of rare integrity, especially for a large-ish FWD car. Just a modicum of ‘slow-in, fast-out’ and understeer ceases to be an issue. Ride comfort is an issue. The ‘Leaf doesn’t really ‘do’ ride comfort (leastwise not in this country) but the fine steering and handling more than compensate. Where the breeding really shows is in the chassis’ ability not to fall apart ‘in extremis’ - you know, those rare moments when, on a twisting country road, you realise that you should have overtaken only four cars rather than five, or when you tackle that long R/H bend ending in a slight crest which just isn’t a crest at normal speeds. The ‘alfisti’ will probably shudder but the words ‘super-executive, 4-door Strada Abarth’ occasionally spring to mind!

The Alfa’s relatively light weight (at 1500 kg approx 200kg lighter than BMW’s 5- or Audi’s 6-series) is a key factor here. Look under the German cars and you’ll see everywhere railway-spec girders linking steering and suspension, whereas under the Alfa it’s all chicken bones (and look, one of them’s broken!) – hence the need for frequent bush replacement.

As befits a top-of-the-line package, the 164 Cloverleaf is a well-equipped car with all the toys and feels special just to sit in. That feeling is hugely enhanced, of course, when you twist the ignition key but do you know what so often makes me smile? Watching the seatbelt warning light extinguish itself after 3 seconds – regardless of whether you’ve donned the belt or not. That, to me, is the real proof of its Italian heritage!"

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ok, the article seems to have migrated okay from my appallingly outdated Windows XP Document File onto this shiny, modern Alfisti website!

Now, all I have to do is figure out how to upload a photo or two - don't wait up for me, I may be some time!

Lightfoot (Oh, and the car's now hit 195,000 miles - still on the original engine. Grazi Giuseppe Busso!)

Kegsti66
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by Kegsti66 »

Welcome to the club !!
Thanks for the read I enjoyed it.
164 's are a stylish classic, shame you don't see more about.
Then again, you can say the same for most older Alfas. Even 156's are getting a rare sight now a days. :(

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PETROLHEAD
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by PETROLHEAD »

Welcome aboard Lightfoot, and excellent first post, a great read. :P

Shrew
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by Johnboy »

Welcome to the mad house chap . Great write up 8-)
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by Lightfoot »

Thank you, Gents.

Sorry the first post was totally subjective appraisal and impressions but light on hard factual info. I've run my 'Leaf since 2002 (it's a '93 on an L reg) and it's completely standard. The most I've ever done is put a K & N air filter into a slightly-opened up airbox which helps a teeny bit, I suppose (especially in cold air conditions). If you're gunning the car the induction noise seems to turn heads up ahead a lot more than before but otherwise I'm not sure there's any measurable performance difference.

The car has been looked after by two specialists in its time with me - originally Alan Bennett at Benalfa Cars in Wiltshire (until Alan found himself down for major heart surgery in 2011, closed his business down and retired) and latterly the guys at Alfa Aid over in Maidenhead.

The main things I've learned from them is to stay well on top of the oil changes, not to run all the way to 72K on the cambelt change (natch!) and always to ensure the subframe bolts can be freed off (especially the rear one) as a lot of Cloverleafs have gone to 164 Heaven due to rusted rear subframes which simply can't be shifted. Luckily my rear subframe developed a major split back in 2004 (when new ones were still obtainable) and so re-conditioning the replacement two years ago was fairly straightforward as it had only been on the car ten years instead of twenty one!

Obviously, there are plenty of parts the availability of which which present a challenge to keeping 164's on the road. My car's steering rack was re-conditioned in Aug '15 and one of the rack mounting bushes was found to be perished. Adrian Jardine (Alfa Aid) ended up 'drafting in' a new one from a Mitsubishi dealer (?) - apparently the Galant of the same era not only used the same 'off the shelf' power steering package but also the same rack mounting bushes as the 164. Anyway, that was the story I was told.

The symptom was turning 90 left, then straightening up to find the car running straight but with the steering wheel still canted ten or so degrees to the left. This then corrected itself the next time you turned 90 right and then straightened up whereupon the steering wheel had magically returned to TDC (as in Top Dead Centre!) to coin a phrase.

Going back to Benalfa Cars I was always amazed whenever I went down to see Alan as he always seemed to have no less than THREE Montreals just sitting out in his field awaiting bodywork - and on each occasion they were never the SAME three! Real shame about Alan - I'd dropped off my series 2 Lancia Montecarlo for bodywork (moth-y door bottoms, windscreen scuttle and wheelarches) and he'd got well into the job when his doctor came up with the bad news and everyone (myself included) had to retrieve their various cars from his premises when Alan wound the business up.

So, I have a Lancia Montecarlo rolling shell, partially re-metalled, complete with engine/gearbox but no paint (!) sitting at the back of my (luckily very dry) garage. If only I'd had the 164's O/S/R wheelarch repaired first...!

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PETROLHEAD
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by PETROLHEAD »

Ooh a monty shell?

Careful, you'll have forum co-founder kev offering you sheckles to buy it from you! :lol:
SHREW

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KevJTD
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by KevJTD »

Lightfoot wrote:Thank you, Gents.

Sorry the first post was totally subjective appraisal and impressions but light on hard factual info. I've run my 'Leaf since 2002 (it's a '93 on an L reg) and it's completely standard. The most I've ever done is put a K & N air filter into a slightly-opened up airbox which helps a teeny bit, I suppose (especially in cold air conditions). If you're gunning the car the induction noise seems to turn heads up ahead a lot more than before but otherwise I'm not sure there's any measurable performance difference.

The car has been looked after by two specialists in its time with me - originally Alan Bennett at Benalfa Cars in Wiltshire (until Alan found himself down for major heart surgery in 2011, closed his business down and retired) and latterly the guys at Alfa Aid over in Maidenhead.

The main things I've learned from them is to stay well on top of the oil changes, not to run all the way to 72K on the cambelt change (natch!) and always to ensure the subframe bolts can be freed off (especially the rear one) as a lot of Cloverleafs have gone to 164 Heaven due to rusted rear subframes which simply can't be shifted. Luckily my rear subframe developed a major split back in 2004 (when new ones were still obtainable) and so re-conditioning the replacement two years ago was fairly straightforward as it had only been on the car ten years instead of twenty one!

Obviously, there are plenty of parts the availability of which which present a challenge to keeping 164's on the road. My car's steering rack was re-conditioned in Aug '15 and one of the rack mounting bushes was found to be perished. Adrian Jardine (Alfa Aid) ended up 'drafting in' a new one from a Mitsubishi dealer (?) - apparently the Galant of the same era not only used the same 'off the shelf' power steering package but also the same rack mounting bushes as the 164. Anyway, that was the story I was told.

The symptom was turning 90 left, then straightening up to find the car running straight but with the steering wheel still canted ten or so degrees to the left. This then corrected itself the next time you turned 90 right and then straightened up whereupon the steering wheel had magically returned to TDC (as in Top Dead Centre!) to coin a phrase.

Going back to Benalfa Cars I was always amazed whenever I went down to see Alan as he always seemed to have no less than THREE Montreals just sitting out in his field awaiting bodywork - and on each occasion they were never the SAME three! Real shame about Alan - I'd dropped off my series 2 Lancia Montecarlo for bodywork (moth-y door bottoms, windscreen scuttle and wheelarches) and he'd got well into the job when his doctor came up with the bad news and everyone (myself included) had to retrieve their various cars from his premises when Alan wound the business up.

So, I have a Lancia Montecarlo rolling shell, partially re-metalled, complete with engine/gearbox but no paint (!) sitting at the back of my (luckily very dry) garage. If only I'd had the 164's O/S/R wheelarch repaired first...!

if you need the space back I'm your man .... :D



loved reading up on the 164 stories though, know john who had shrews car and also a very nice Q4 version loves them, I wasn't quite so keen to be a passenger in the Q4 as being a LHD car you were sat out in the traffic whilst he gunned it, and he DID gun it!!
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PETROLHEAD
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by PETROLHEAD »

Ha ha!

You're so predictable Kev! :lol:

But i dont blame you, i was perusing Monte's myself the other night, lovely bits of kit :P
SHREW

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KevJTD
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by KevJTD »

petrolhead wrote:Ha ha!

You're so predictable Kev! :lol:

But i dont blame you, i was perusing Monte's myself the other night, lovely bits of kit :P

entirely predictable, and ever the optimist that the planets will align someday mate :D
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Lancia Delta integrale
Lancia Flavia coupe 1.8 1963
Lancia Dedra turbo
Renault Clio 197 RS

I'm bad with people things
But I should have tried more

jobeed
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by jobeed »

Was the 037 based on the monte?

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PETROLHEAD
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by PETROLHEAD »

Kind of Jon.

Similar floor plan, but engine rotated to inline iirc.

I personally think the 037 and stradale rally are the best looking of all that era, and a little bit in the shadow of the stratos before and delta afterwards.

Gorgeous cars and a fantastic period for Lancia, even if most of those cars were very much parted and sourced Fiat derivatives.
SHREW

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Alfasud 1.7-16v, Charade Turbo SR, & The Dirty Diesels - GT Cloverleaf, 159 Ti Sportwagon, Saab 9-3 Sportwagon

Lightfoot
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by Lightfoot »

Kev,

If you're perchance lusting after a Lancia Montecarlo then this below is probably the best currently on the market:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1983-Lancia-M ... Swu1VW6ZYc

Genuine 'dry' South African import and a one-owner from new car now in the UK!

Lightfoot
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by Lightfoot »

It also seems to have got itself 'stuck' bidding-wise around the £10K mark...

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KevJTD
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Re: Already in Love!

Post by KevJTD »

plus I have a habit of buying a cheap wreck and spending twice the difference getting to that stage :D
Giulietta JTD 170
Lancia Delta integrale
Lancia Flavia coupe 1.8 1963
Lancia Dedra turbo
Renault Clio 197 RS

I'm bad with people things
But I should have tried more

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